optimised media--what about the original files?

I always transcode my video to the pro res. But this means that everything is duplicated on my HDD. Is there any point keeping the original files? Can we just delete them immediately?

Cheers

Waddo

You can keep them as a backup copy, or trash them. If FCP X has created ProRes, and/or copied the originals into the Event, trash them from their original location, if you don't need a backup copy.

Yes I copy my files from the cards to one drive, then in Final Cut: import, but don't copy media, create optimised instead. Then I have a back up of your footage on a separate drive and no original media in my event.

I do the same method as Seanus except I prefer to transcode and edit using Proxy media since I don't have a fast RAID. I then keep an additional copy of the original files on another slower USB drive. So I have 2 master quality files and 1 proxy file spread over three drives. Hrmmm, seems a bit much, but then again it's saved me before! It's your footage. You can NEVER have enough backups

I heard a quote on another forum that I never forgot.

1 is none, and 2 is one. Speaking of backups

If you're making a living with this, and you don't have a reliable backup, you could be liable.

I named my media drive "dat-az", so once a week I can "back dat-az up!" I know, one of the worst IT jokes ever, but there you have it.

Be sure you have a charge for drive space in the fees you charge customers. They need to be paying for these drives, we're not charities.

could you tell me what the Proxy media is exactly? And I assume it's an option when first ingesting the media.

You're right you normally create it when you import your media. But you can always transcode any footage to proxy media later if you like.

The purpose is to create files that are small and easy for Final Cut to play, particularly vital of your doing something with a lot of Multicam or your editing HD footage on a low end laptop. As time marches on and source media gets higher and higher resolutions I'm sure more often we will be editing with Proxy media first.

Hi. Thanks for the reply.

Actually I have a 27inch iMac with 3.06GHz core 2 duo and 8 gigs of ram. My media is on a separate firewire drive. This should probably be a different thread, but even with this set up, I find FCX often stutters along, beach ball shows up often and audio drop out occurs during playback. I am using Lion, which I think adds to the problems. FCP7 ran fine.

So, my question is, in future if I choose proxy media, do you think this would smooth things up a lot?

Yes, proxy media should respond much smoother. It will appear less in quality but will allow you to edit faster. Remember to switch back to Original or Optimized Media before you export your finished project.

You can also set your playback preference for Better Performance as opposed to High Quality.

Lion works well with fcpx...there may be some issues but not the ones you're describing. Also remember that the external firewire drive should be 7200 rpm and not a 5400 rpm drive. Firewire 800 will be better than 400 but even the FW800 drive is barely fast enough to deliver multiple streams of HD footage. SD DV should be no problem.

From the FCPX manual:

Apple ProRes
The Apple ProRes codecs provide an unparalleled combination of multistream, real-time editing performance coupled with impressive image quality at reduced storage rates.

In particular, the Apple ProRes codecs have been designed to work especially well as high-quality, high-performance editing codecs for Final Cut Pro, taking full advantage of multicore processing and featuring fast, reduced-resolution decoding modes.

All members of the Apple ProRes codec family support any frame size (including SD, HD, 2K, and 4K) at full resolution. The data rate of Apple ProRes varies based on codec type, image content, frame size, and frame rate.

Apple ProRes includes the following formats:

Apple ProRes 4444: This codec offers the best quality for 4:4:4:4 sources and for workflows involving alpha channels. It features:

Full-resolution, mastering-quality 4:4:4:4 RGBA color, perceptually indistinguishable from the original material with excellent multigeneration performance

Mathematically lossless alpha channel (up to 16 bits) with real-time playback

High-quality solution for storing and exchanging motion graphics and composites

A remarkably low data rate compared to uncompressed 4:4:4 HD (the target data rate is approximately 330 Mbps for 4:4:4 sources at 1920 x 1080 and 29.97 fps)

Direct encoding of, and decoding to, both RGB and Y′CbCr pixel formats

Apple ProRes 422 (HQ): This codec preserves visual quality at the same high level as Apple ProRes 4444, but for 4:2:2 image sources. With widespread adoption across the video post-production industry, Apple ProRes 422 (HQ) offers visually lossless preservation of the highest-quality professional HD video that a (single-link) HD-SDI signal can carry. This codec supports full-width, 4:2:2 video sources at 10-bit pixel depths, while remaining visually lossless through many generations of decoding and reencoding. The target data rate of Apple ProRes 422 (HQ) is approximately 220 Mbps at 1920 x 1080 and 29.97 fps.

Apple ProRes 422: This codec offers nearly all the benefits of Apple ProRes 422 (HQ), but at 66 percent of the data rate for even better multistream, real-time editing performance.

Apple ProRes 422 (LT): With a target data rate that is roughly 70 percent of the data rate of Apple ProRes 422 and 30 percent smaller file sizes than Apple ProRes 422, this codec is perfect for environments where storage capacity and bandwidth are at a premium.

Apple ProRes 422 (Proxy): This codec is intended for use in offline workflows that require low data rates but full-resolution video. The target data rate is roughly 30 percent of the data rate of Apple ProRes 422.

I find FCPX to be a bit sluggish when using native media from DSLR camera, so I always transcode. Because I have so much footage for my doc, I've been using Proxy to save on hard drive space and just switching over to the native files for export. But I've also noticed that proxy is really essential for doing 1080 work on a firewire 800 drive. I've got a pretty fast system, but the bottleneck of drive speed is killing me. I'm hoping NAB this year has some more affordable T-Bolt solutions for me to take a look at.

I'm working with HDSLR footage as well. I would always optimize my media to ProRes. I found that running FCPX on a solid state drive greatly improves FCPX's performance but a lot of the struggle comes with using a drive that is external to your system.

It is always recommended that you place your footage on a drive that isn't your boot drive because it allows your application to focus on running the application and not on reading the footage. For this reason your media is to be placed on a separate drive. If you're dealing in a less than professional environment (access to storage solutions such as RAID or other high speed and high volume data management), then you may be forced to use something like a USB 2.0 or FireWire 800 drive. These are practical for most uses but in the world of HD video editing, it can be problematic at times.

If you fall into the USB 2.0 or FW 800 category, then Proxy is the way to go if you want to be able to edit without the hassle of beach-balling or latency.

I would avoid USB2 at all costs. It does not deliver a continuous stream of video but rather segments in packet bursts. Not ideal for editing directly. Save those drives for completed projects storage.
FW800 is a bare minimum for editing HD.

waddo wrote: I always transcode my video to the pro res. But this means that everything is duplicated on my HDD. Is there any point keeping the original files? Can we just delete them immediately?

Cheers

Waddo

I would like to get this thread back on track if I may and ask Waddo, have you had any problems deleting the original media from your events folders? I've got a small eSata enclosure connected to my iMac via the Sonnet Echo Thunderbolt adapter. It contains 2 each 1 TB SATA drives which I have converted into a 2 GB software RAID 0. This setup gives me close to 200 MB/s so I'm having no problems editing multiclip on a 3 cam wedding.

I have all of my original files copied from my SD cards to another external drive so when I create a project, I import those files into my events folder on my RAID and create Pro-Res files. So like you have asked above, there is no need for those original files right? I mean they really server no additional purpose right? I just need to be sure it doesn't mess up the database if I delete those original files. I can't think of any reason for ever having to reconnect to the original files right? I mean even if I copy my events/projects to a different drive, the pro-res files are going to be where they belong.

Ahhh, but this may be a potential problem.... what If I delete those original files, and later decide to create proxy files? It won't be able to will it, because it needs those original files, right?

Does anyone actually use this workflow and delete original files?

If you're not using the original files to edit with, there's no need for them, aside from a backup copy for safe keeping. So there's no need to copy them into your Events folder in the first place if you have a backup copy somewhere.

You can create proxy files from the Optimized ProRes files.

Okay. What do you need to do then if you decide later that you want to create proxy files?

Hi, Ron...
Ben's last sentence addressed that. You can still create proxy files from your imported prores files...your originals wouldn't be needed.

You might also consider whether you need to transcode to prores at all. If your original media is good enough and edits well on your machine, you could just use that. Those files may be smaller than the transcoded prores files.

One way or another, you'll either have original media or optimized media on your drives. Either one can be used later to obtain proxies.

If you want to create Proxies once you've already ingested the footage as full ProRes, then you can do it by going to File: Transcode Media and selecting Proxy in the check box. BTW, Proxy Media is actually half res (960 x 540) but is set fit to fill on the timeline.

From the Manual:

Transcode clips after import
Control-click one or more clips in the Event Browser and choose Transcode Media from the shortcut menu.

In the window that appears, select the “Create optimized media” checkbox, the “Create proxy media” checkbox, or both, and click OK.

Note: If the original camera format can be edited with good performance, the “Create optimized media” option will be dimmed.

On another note: I am horrified by the suggestion that was made to "dump" the original media. NEVER dump the original media, you never know when you want to go back to it. I suppose you can back it up to an external drive and get it off your system if you have that little space, but I always want to have it handy, just in case.

PaulG wrote: On another note: I am horrified by the suggestion that was made to "dump" the original media. NEVER dump the original media, you never know when you want to go back to it. I suppose you can back it up to an external drive and get it off your system if you have that little space, but I always want to have it handy, just in case.

Well that's my question. I know how to create proxy files, but I guess I'm asking, how does FCP create proxy files after you have removed the original media from the event? Does it create proxy files from the ProRes files considering the original files are gone (even though they are backed up on another drive)? And what happens if you need to reconnect files for any reason, how would that work if you have deleted the original files?