"Flatten" FCPX MultiClip

Ok so I completed my Multiclip edit, now I want to go in and Color Correct and add a few effects to my edits, however for my particular project I can't seem to find a simple way to this.

I only want to Color Grade my selected angles in my timeline.
Now I know I can go into the angle editor and do one grade on my angles and be done with it however for my particular multiclip this wont work because the cameras are moving all over the place so what looks nice at one position will not look so good at another.

I ran into this problem when I went to Stabilize some clips after the edit was complete.
Since we have ZERO control of the selected angles (effects/CC, etc) in the timeline I had to go into the angle editor to apply my stabilizations, well in order for stabilize to work I need to apply stabilize to only certain areas of the clips, not the whole clip when the camera is moving all around repositioning and what not.

While the angle editor is extremely powerful I find not being able to manipulate the clips in my "master" timeline a huge PITA.

Anyway my question is, is there any way to "flatten" out the multiclip to work on ONLY selected angles???

And please let me know if I'm missing something, however as many tutorials and as much as I've worked in multicam, I think its a limitation of the software at this point…

Thanks

There is no flattening of multicam clips.
However you could place the multiclip into a compound clip and apply color correction to the entire clip, or even chop up the clip and apply as needed.

Also, you could cut the clips as needed in the angle editor, and then apply color correction to each as needed.
This way you could quickly apply color corrections to the clips that changed due to lighting conditions.

After you cut the clips in the angle viewer, you could try to use match color and see if this works. But for me I might actually start with copy and paste all attributes as a starting point and then adjust as needed. As from my experience this tends to work better for me than match color.

Thanks for the prompt reply!

Yes I managed to apply stabilize to my selected clips in the angle editor by "recutting" my selected angles.
I did not want to have to do this as there are a lot of lighting changes and camera repositioning within the multiclips. Very tedious work and essentially I'm doubling up on the work I've already done by selecting certain angles in the 1st place, now I essentially have to do it all over again ugh.

I like the idea of making the multiclip a compound clip and then cutting that up (one grade on a compound clip will not work as there are just too many changes)

Hopefully Apple will fix this...

Even though you might have tried to consolidate your camera angles, by ganging them on certain angles. If you do in fact have this many varying clips, then I might have treated them as separate angles in the first place.


Since you have so many changes, I don't see any way to do this without color corrections each section of video.
You could try adding additional tracks for the varying camera clips, and then swap them out in your multiclip. Then apply the color correction to the new angles.

mliebergot wrote: You could try adding additional tracks for the varying camera clips, and then swap them out in your multiclip. Then apply the color correction to the new angles.

This may work, I'll try it.

As for making additional multiclips for the varying shots, idk I think that would have taken more time setting them all up, for me if I was to do that it'd be faster just to use my methods I've been using pre-FCPX multiclip.
BTW they are all synced to one separate audio file.

I have 3 separate multiclips in my 30min timeline, the setup and editing went flawless and saved a lot of time, its just now the finishing work is becoming a PITA due to the current implantation of Multicam.
Apple NEEDS to update it to behave how FCP7 did. otherwise for me and my style on some projects it won't even be worth using multicam...

I do appreciate the suggestions and I will try and figure out the fastest most efficient way of dealing with this scenario.

update: managed to CC all my multiclips much faster than I thought I would.

For the most part I just got lucky and my grades held up under different lighting situations within the multiclip. When this would not work I also copied/pasted effects/scale rotations from clips that were not used in multiclips onto my selections in the "master" timeline.

NOTE: You CANNOT copy/paste from clips in the master timeline into clips in the angle editor, this was a hold-up but I managed to work around it.

Still though the angle editor is VERY powerful but we still need to be able to manipulate our selections once we lock the edit in a master timeline.
Seems Apple went 100 steps forward and 1 step back with this implementation of Multicam…All this aside, I'm very impressed.

Thanks again for the suggestions!

Just out of curiosity, why do you really need to flatten the multiclip anyway.
Couldn't you simply work with the multiclip on the storyline (not in the angle editor), and then simply make the color correction to one of the varying cameras and then simply o a copy and paste attributes to all of the corresponding clips on the story-line. Then simply tweak as needed.


This wouldn't be any different than flattening the multiclip in FCP7 and then adjust as needed.

mliebergot wrote: Just out of curiosity, why do you really need to flatten the multiclip anyway.
Couldn't you simply work with the multiclip on the storyline (not in the angle editor), and then simply make the color correction to one of the varying cameras and then simply o a copy and paste attributes to all of the corresponding clips on the story-line. Then simply tweak as needed.


This wouldn't be any different than flattening the multiclip in FCP7 and then adjust as needed.

Well to my knowledge this only halfway works…

The caveats are:

- Cannot perform initial grade on a multiclip in the master timeline (only can be done in the Angle Editor)

- If you make a grade in the Angle Editor, I cannot Copy/Paste To/From the Angle Editor to finesse the colors/effects back in the master timeline to compensate for lighting changes within the multiclip

- When I originally made this post FCPX was bugging out and was not letting me select "Copy" or "Paste Effects" on clips made from a multicam session in my master timeline, upon a restart I am now able to select Copy/Paste on said clips, still the "gothcha" it seems is that initial Grade/Effects must be done on a clip not contained in a multiclip and then you can copy/paste from there.

I still cannot figure out a way to easily stabilize just selected angles of my edited multiclip, short of going into the angle editor and blade cutting the sections/angles that were used/selected. This is very tedious work and there has to be a better way of achieving this.

mliebergot wrote: Even though you might have tried to consolidate your camera angles, by ganging them on certain angles. If you do in fact have this many varying clips, then I might have treated them as separate angles in the first place.

I do not think making multiple multiclips is the solution because I'd have soooo many short multiclips if I cut out the "in-between" stuff. I'd think setting all that up and dealing with it would take a lot of time so it be like whats the point of doing the multiclip...

quote="mliebergot" post=4787]Even though you might have tried to consolidate your camera angles, by ganging them on certain angles. If you do in fact have this many varying clips, then I might have treated them as separate angles in the first place.[/quote]


I do not think making multiple multiclips is the solution because I'd have soooo many short multiclips if I cut out the "in-between" stuff. I'd think setting all that up and dealing with it would take a lot of time so it be like whats the point of doing the multiclip...[/quote]
I'm not saying make them all different multiclips.
What I'm saying is that you make 1 multiclip sync as normal.
Then after they are synced... add some new angles and drag the synced clips from one angle to a new angle.

Then go ahead and cut your multiclip, and color correct the angles as needed.

After I posted I had a feeling thats what you meant, great suggestion!
Clips with varying angles, cut them up and add angles as the setups/lighting changes but all within one multiclip.

I will definitely apply this thinking for the next project.

However I've noticed something very strange:

In FCPX in your master timeline if you open up the Color Board on a regular clip and keep the Color Board selected and then select an angle from your multiclip you will now have access to the ColorBoard for this angle in the master timeline, however once you click out of the color board or try and make a secondary correction you will lose the ability to access the Color Board in the master timeline and must resort to the Angle Editor or Copy/Paste.

This "bug" tells me this is a feature that will be implemented and is just sloppy programming on Apples part that this feature slipped through half functional...

I'm finding I can put effects, color correct, do secondaries, etc, to my clips in the Project timeline for a Multiclip edit just fine. I'm not finding any limitations at all. Works just like a regular edit.

Sloppy programming? What is sloppy programming?

Really Ben, you can add Grades and stabilize multiclip selects back in your timeline (not just the angle editor)??
This function does not work for me and I've tried on another FCPX system, same behavior.

I'm no programmer but IMO (if this is indeed a bug and not just a few isolated cases)
sloppy programming is what I described in my post. A feature that halfway and inconsistently
works in a final release...A feature that is vital and worked in older version of FCP I may add.

I hope this is an isolated case but Ben, perhaps you don't understand exactly what I'm describing...

Yep, I'm doing it right now, no problems at all. I understand exactly what you're describing. I can select a clip, open the color corrector, grade it, apply effects, go to a different clip, select it, do the same, no problems at all.

There are no older versions of FCP X that had multicam clips. And all software has bugs in every release. No such thing as an app that has no bugs in any release. That's the reality of software development, not sloppy programming. Any new feature in any app is prone to bugs in it's initial release. Fill out the feedback page and let them know.

Yes you can apply color correction to individual clips in any multiclip timeline, and you can copy/paste the corrections to any other clip.

Stabilization however is greyed out in the multiclip timeline. Stabilization requires analyzing the original media and apparently in a multiclip project FCP10 wants to analyze the entire original media (i.e. your entire angle) instead of just the part of the media you have selected in your timeline. I guess that's why at this stage they want you to do your stabilization in the angle editor. The same thing happened when stabilization was introduced in legacy FCP: in the beginning stabilization required analyzing the entire original media, not just the portion of the clip that you selected in your sequence. When people started complaining about this it was improved in a later update.

I agree being able to stabilize individual clips in a multiclip timeline would be a good feature. So I have sent a feature request regarding this. If more people do this, eventually this feature will get higher on the priority list. This has nothing to do with poor programming, it's a matter of priorities while improving a workflow based on real-life feedback. In the meantime chopping up the angle in the angle editor is a good workaround.

Wow well if you guys say it works, I'll assume it does and chalk it up to my system bugging out and a few isolated bugs.

Having said that any idea why my system does not allow me to work on multiclip selection in my project timeline? (again I have no issues in the angle editor)

I can forgive stabilization not working on multiclip selections (for now) due to how that needs to process clips but we need to sometimes CC just our selections and not be limited to all or nothing in the angle editor but you guys say it works so...

I only say sloppy programming due to the fact that I have to "trick" FCPX into allowing me to CC my selections and even then I can only do a primary grade, the second I click off the clip I lose the ability to do anything to the clip and only have access to the Info tab...

Ben I understand that new software can have many bugs, but with all the software and new software I use in my day-to-day work I've never had to "trick" software into doing specific tasks nor have seen quite as much bizarre behavior as I've seen in and had to deal with in FCPX although 10.0.3 has cleaned much of this up.
Although you say it's a brand-new piece of software I see the number 10 in that version number

Hi Mickey,

I honestly have no clue as to why this does not work for you. I can do multiple CC and secondaries on any clip in a multiclip project, switch back and forth and copy/paste corrections. Just an long shot: maybe you should trash your FCP10 prefs and see if this solves the problem.

"...I've never had to "trick" software into doing specific tasks nor have seen quite as much bizarre behavior..."

Um, I recall several occasions you have.

"Although you say it's a brand-new piece of software I see the number 10 in that version number."

You know better than that, Mickey. Claiming the "X" is in the name doesn't hold up. "X" is a branding strategy that Apple has been using for some time now. OS "X" was a brand new OS when version 1 came out, it has nothing to do with anything that came before it, but it was called "X" not as a version number, but as a brand name.

That said, name one other app that has has so many major updates, so fast, and for free? None. Apple is pumping out updates to FCP X faster than any other NLE is capable of, due to the Mac App Store model. Not to mention that model is "pay once", you won't be paying $300 again for major updates any time soon. Name another NLE that does that. How long did Avid take to bring MC up to date with features PPro and QT based FCP have had for years? Oh, right, “YEARS”. Yet FCP X has grown and matured and stabilized faster than any other app on the market, and we have all benefited from it.

Here's the deal on software development, from someone who has spent more years than I can count working professionally in that field. ALL software releases have bugs, some more than others. I recall a few upgrades to MC and PPro that were super major buggy. I recall Adobe releasing a PS patch very fast when it was super buggy a few versions back. And that was all upgrades to existing technology and coding. They were not (and have never) dealt with totally new technology built from the ground up like Apple has dared to do. So yes, compare the apples to onions if you want.

When software is developed, it is tested as best as it can be in a dev lab. That is limited. No developer has access to every different configuration of hardware and software possible on the computes it's being designed for. That physically can't happen. Other software, plugins (OS and app based), peripherals and their various versions (and their various driver versions), etc? It would take literally thousands, if not millions of Macs set up with all of these different configurations to work out all the bugs. So, software developers do their best, and fix things once the initial release is done. When an initial upgrade release is done, developers have time and resources set aside for fixing bugs as quickly and securely as they are able. That takes a lot of research, and a lot of time.

Given how quickly Apple has given us new features and bug fixes, in infinity shorter times than any other app ever in history, I'd say they're the total opposite of sloppy programming, but very focused, on target, very conscientious programming. They're doing better than any other NLE developer is. Avid still has bugs to fix in MC they haven't addressed yet, but Apple has done so several times in that period.

Sloppy programming is what Avid has done with Media Composer for YEARS! But why hasn't anyone accused them of sloppy programming?

Considering that Apple (and third parties) are developing FCP X, Motion 5, Compressor 4, all for a whole new Framework technology, for a whole new type of application technology, and NOT a simple update to old QuickTime Framework coding, here's the factual, technical truth; For the amount of bugs we've had, considering all of that, we've actually had very few bugs, and they're being fixed at a phenomenally fast rate.

So, forgive me if I don't see where "sloppy programming" is evident at all anywhere.

P.S. Mickey and I know each other personally here in Louisiana, so our back and forth is not all that big of a deal. As much as we argue online, I respect this young kid a lot. He's part of my Louisiana Cajun Cutters FCPUG, he's a good editor, great cam op, impressive resume, hire him!

Ha! Thanks Ben, I appreciate the kind words and once again you're experience and perspective is very enlightening.

I cannot agree more with you regarding how aggressively Apple is updating the software and adding features (most of which seem to be directly related to user feedback, definitely my own) compared to other NLE's. I really hope they keep it up and don't stall.

We have to agree to disagree on the whole X/10 naming conventions…Yes it is a whole new app built from the ground up so many bugs are to be expected however I see the NUMBER 10 in the version number, therefore I expect many key features from the previous version number to carry over and they weren't.
I started using OSX (and Apple period) with Jaguar so I can't comment on the OS9-OSX transition.

As for the pricing structure of when we will have to pay again, well I don't know but I'm looking forward to seeing how that pans out. While I'm very happy with the state FCPX is in now, I'd be pretty upset if I had to pay again at this point (even an update price). there are still a few features I feel should be in a point update before they can charge again.
namely:

-Motion/FCPX round-tripping
-Better Back-ups/versioning of project files
-Better performance/bug fixes
-Copy/Paste selected effects (not this all or nothing baloney, I've noticed that copying effects to my clips affects any audio changes I've made, major PITA)

Thats off the top of my head but fix these and I'd buy a new version of FCP11 or whatever it called

I relate this to the Final Fantasy 14 video game release where Square really dropped the ball and could not dream of charging the monthly fee until the game got up to expectations…
You nerds on here will know what i'm talking about...
(Still though FCPX was a much better release then FF14 was compared to FCP11 lol)


Anyway thanks again for everyones suggestions, hopefully I'll get this resolved.

You should have seen the instability in Final Cut Pro 1.0.0.

Face the reality of the technology, not the superficial commercialism of a name.