3 Clips With Framerates 29.73 25 30.01 And Time is not real time.

I have 3 clips, synchronized into a compound clip.
My project is 23.98 (only because I read that's the best setting).
I have found that 2 minutes are longer. If I speed it up by 101% it's about right.

Here is another way to describe it. If I look at the properties of the clip it's 2:04 (or something higher than what it should be), I only found this out because I actually placed a 2 minute timer on the timeline and they don't match up.
I have no idea what's going on or how to prevent this. I've had this with other videos too. I am assuming it has something to do with the frames of the project and that of the clips. The problem is, I will always have clips from different cameras with different frame rates.

I would appreciate it very much if someone could enlighten me on what's going on and how to fix it.

I am also confused by the fact that it seems the clips are slower but I can't hear it or see it. Perhaps 1% to 2% slower is not noticeable.

The attachment shows what I am trying to explain. The highlighted clip is 2 minutes long, the video clip it's placed over contains a part that is 2 minutes long, so it's supposed to end where the highlighted clip ends, but it ends where the needle is located.

What is the frame rate of those clips?

I retime stuff to fit TV broadcast times. You can go 94% - 104% and not notice any difference. Depending on the content, you can put that slightly further.

Hi, the frame rates were in the title, sorry, forgot to put them in the description.
"3 Clips With Framerates 29.73 25 30.01 And Time is not real time."
I'd like to get it where I don't need to mess about with any retiming. I'd also like to understand why it happens.

taco.fleur wrote: "I will always have clips from different cameras with different frame rates....Frame rates 29.73 25 30.01 And Time is not real time...I'd like to get it where I don't need to mess about with any retiming. I'd also like to understand why it happens...

Whenever you have mixed frame rates it can cause complications. Some are more straightforward to handle in post production and others are difficult. It is vital when planning and executing video production that extreme emphasis be conveyed to all contributors that everyone should only use the designated frame rate. In post production that frame rate should be used for the timeline, and the final exported product should normally be that frame rate.

Exceptions include cameras shooting an even multiple of the chosen frame rate, e.g, 59.94 fps for a 29.97 fps timeline, or 50 fps for a 25 fps timeline. Those can be "rate conformed" smoothly and with no artifacts. If the contributed material comes from different world regions where the cameras or smart phones have no capability to achieve a common frame rate, then you must accept that -- but only after strenuous efforts to communicate ahead of time to everybody and achieve the least variation and most compatible frame rates possible.

In the modern era of contributed footage from smart phones, it may not be as easy. However my iPhone built-in camera app has settings for 24, 30 and 60 fps. It's a simple config setting.

If someone captures and contributes a sudden news event with their cell phone (plane crash, tornado, etc), the news org. has to accept it. That person had no warning and wasn't part of a planned effort. But oftentimes even informal loosely-planned events shot on smart phones can be coordinated ahead of time to use a designated frame rate.

Re why did your material seemingly change timeline durations, when a NLE "rate conforms" different frame rates, there are various algorithms. When conforming 25 and 24 (or 23.98) material the algorithm is an automatic speed change. You designated a 23.98p timeline and to conform 25p fps material requires it be speeded up or shortened slightly.

By contrast when rate conforming 23.98p and 29.97p material it's possible to discard or duplicate certain frames, thereby reducing the mis-match. However it introduces a motion cadence issue where subject or camera motion is less smooth. This in turn can sometimes be lessened by using optical flow rate conforming (not optical flow retiming).

To use optical flow rate conforming, select a clip in the timeline with a non-matching frame rate, then in the FCPX video inspector, scroll to bottom and under Frame Sampling select Optical Flow. Then select that clip in the timeline, render with CTRL+R, and examine the playback smoothness. If that works, do all the clips with frame rates that differ from the timeline rate.

This normally improves smoothness at the cost of significant CPU time. But in some cases it can cause morphing artifacts so you must check for those on every clip.

Typically 29.97 to 23.98 is a more difficult conversion than the opposite direction. I think 25 is handled similarly. You might get better results from using a 29.97 timeline, that way the 29.97 and 30.01 material would closely match and rate conversions from 25 to 29.97 might be better. It would likely not retime the 25 fps material but use some frame duplication algorithm which you might be able to smooth using optical flow rate conforming.

Gerald Undone discusses mixing frame rates in this video:

taco.fleur wrote: Hi, the frame rates were in the title, sorry, forgot to put them in the description.
"3 Clips With Framerates 29.73 25 30.01 And Time is not real time."
I'd like to get it where I don't need to mess about with any retiming. I'd also like to understand why it happens.

I was making a point. You're trying to sync different frame rates, that's the problem. Really bad idea. Then if you have different audio sample rates, you're hosed.

Thank you for your detailed reply.

I'm experiencing OP frame rate problems, the only solution I found is manually looking for the best % to fit all clips (huge pain) or doing it in Premiere... I'm used to jump from one software to another depending on the project so that's is how it is...
I jumped to FCP because the render times are a fraction of Pr, but it has so many limitations that is somehow frustrating.

cocoua wrote:

I'm experiencing OP frame rate problems, the only solution I found is manually looking for the best % to fit all clips (huge pain) or doing it in Premiere....

The OP issue was a mix of frame rates and he did not understand rate conforming. This happens with any NLE. I use FCP, Resolve Studio and Premiere -- it happens with all of them. 

There are different rate conforming algorithms for each conversion. Some such as 23.98 to 29.97 will maintain rate and sync with external audio. Others such as 24.0 or 23.98 to 25.0 will cause a rate change and will drift out of sync with external audio or other A/V clips. Each case must be examined individually.

If you can list the frame rates of each clip and your timeline frame rate, maybe we can help you.

well, in my scenario, 3 clips at 24 fps and one at 25 fps video in FCP didn't match, I had to manually try percentages until reach the correct one, but several projects with this settings, and the percentage was different in each project, between 96,07 and 99.1, so I couldn't find a perfect match and have so many videos to do yet... 

In Pr all they are OK from the beginning, no tweaks, all automatic... So for this project I'm using Pr. Not big deal, only thing is render times are x9 so rendering at nights as in the old times (1h in FCP Vs 9h in Pr or 12h in AME)...

cocoua wrote:

...In Pr all they are OK from the beginning, no tweaks, all automatic.....

I thought in Premiere you had to manually select the clips and pick Clip>Modify>Interpret Footage, however that will not fix a sync problem with external audio.

There are various posts on Adobe problems where people are having problems with this.