Apple is abandoning the pro, IMHO.

Apologies for the length of this post but I’ve been wanting to say this for a while. I’m not a troll, if anything I’ve been an Apple fanboy for years. I run a small production facility and we are currently directing and photographing a commissioned doc for a leading content provider. We have been using Apple machines for years and our current crop is a Macpro, a MacBook pro, a MacBook Air, three iPads, two 7plus iPhones. We have used Apple since the G5 (remember that?), used the early fcp versions, right up to 7 and started learning fcpx on a spare machine, literally within an hour of its release. I and my team prefer Sierra to Win 10, although Win is getting better, and we love the design of the products. Until recently we loved their performance but it seems to us, sadly, that Apple are slowly but surely abandoning the pro user base. They claim otherwise but actions speak much louder than words.

They dropped aperture and then fcp7, both highly respected programs, without having replacements ready. Fcpx was literally years away from being ready and no effort at all was made to replace aperture. The same has happened with their machines. A few years ago we had a couple of tower macs, wonderful looking and great performance, and an early MacBook pro that outperformed their windows rivals by a country mile. No longer. Our current Macpro has been replaced twice, still overheats and gets outperformed by a significant margin by our two windows based desktops. And we don’t have the option of upgrading any of our Apple machines because Apple saw fit to make that impossible. 

You could argue that fcpx is being developed at a fast rate and is now a leading nle. Well, I disagree. Compare the resources of Apple with those of BlackMagicDesign. Like comparing the might of the USA with Luxemburg (no disrespect to L). Resolve 14 is now in public beta 2. It not only has the best color grading ability available, with an nle that has database management ability and speed that rivals fcpx but it now incorporates a sound suite that rivals Pro Tools. We have been using resolve 10,11 12 for grading and have started using 12 for editing. Once you learn the program, it really does rival fcpx in terms of data management and speed. I expect some to dispute that but will wonder if they have actually fully learnt resolve, or simply dabbled on an underpowered machine After the so-called fast development of fcpx, where is it at now? An interface that resembles iMovie, a color grading ability that even Adobe Premiere betters. Do you really like the color board? So why is Color Finale doing so well? Why does serious grading require a roundtrip to resolve?And the sound mixing/sweetening ability of fcpx, is it at the pro level? Its barely at the amateur level. And how about the tracking in fcpx, how does that compare with resolve's class leading, automatically key framed tracker and power windows (which also automatically record complex grading changes)? It doesn’t have that facility. The only way you’ll get close is if you buy Mocha.  There are other features that resolve is better at, or that fcpx still doesn’t have but the point is surely made. And it’s easy to forget, all of this is free and has been since version 9. And if you're not happy with the very comprehensive free version you will now only have to pay the same as fcpx for the studio version with some impressive extras.

As I said, I’m not a troll and I have no connection with BMD other than as an impressed user. We use resolve but don't use BM cameras - we use red and canon. I’m just a sad pro who wants to keep using Apple after all these years but simply can’t justify it any longer. We'll keep our Apple machines as long as we can, but their slower performance is already costing us production time and money compared with our windows workstations. 

Aperture had a good sized development team and was being developed up until shortly before it was dropped without warning. It really wouldn’t surprise me if fcpx went the same way. And the bottom line for Apple is that this is bad marketing. People started using Macs because the pros used them. The design helped but nothing speaks louder than pro use.

I’m not going to respond to any flamers. I’ll happily engage in genuine debate but if, as often happens on the net, people start getting personal, I’ll find better ways to spend my time. I wrote this because I want to be wrong. I want the new Macpro to be released this year, not "possibly in two years", and for it to thrash our windows machines so that we don’t have to abandon Apple completely. But I’m starting to cost windows gear because I want my small production facility to survive in this ever more competitive climate. Please prove me wrong, Apple.

it's not about "flaming you" it's just about ... go and work with Resolve and adios

So you're not happy. What's the constructive reason for posting this? Half your points are not accurate, that's all I'll say. Not getting into a pissing match, which is all a post like this results in.

stewpid wrote: ...it seems to us, sadly, that Apple are slowly but surely abandoning the pro user base. They claim otherwise but actions speak much louder than words...

While this is an understandable concern, Apple just repeated their support for the pro user base. FCPX is being aggressively developed, there is a new Mac Pro coming and probably an "iMac Pro".

stewpid wrote: ....Our current Macpro has been replaced twice, still overheats and gets outperformed by a significant margin by our two windows based desktops....We have been using...resolve....12 for editing. Once you learn the program, it really does rival fcpx in terms of data management and speed.

This is an FCPX forum. If you are talking about Resolve or Premiere on a Mac vs Windows machine, what does that have to do with FCPX? I seriously doubt any editing software outperforms FCPX on Mac hardware. I have tested this myself many times with Premiere 2017 vs FCPX.

Here are two videos where Dave Dugdale (learningvideo.com) is complaining about how slow Resolve 12 is on 4k -- even on a overclocked 4Ghz 8-core Windows PC with a GTX-1080 Ti:

stewpid wrote: ....Do you really like the color board? So why is Color Finale doing so well? Why does serious grading require a roundtrip to resolve?

The color board works fine for what it is. Apple made an intentional decision to leverage the plugin community, just like Microsoft does for 3rd-party Windows utilities.

stewpid wrote: ... resolve....is free and has been since version 9....

Black Magic has done a good job developing Resolve, and the free status is increasingly an issue for Adobe and Avid. Apple makes enough money from FCPX to cover the development cost, but for professional work I don't think the $299 one-time price for up to 10 computers that you own or control is a significant issue.

stewpid wrote: ...We'll keep our Apple machines as long as we can, but their slower performance is already costing us production time and money compared with our windows workstations....

Again, this is an FCPX forum. If you are not using FCPX I am sympathetic to the performance issues caused by slower software on the available Apple hardware. That is an issue Apple is addressing because they cannot sell hardware just to run FCPX. Hopefully the upcoming revised MacBook Pro, "iMac Pro" and new Mac Pro will help out.

stewpid wrote: ...Aperture had a good sized development team and was being developed up until shortly before it was dropped without warning. It really wouldn’t surprise me if fcpx went the same way....

There is no basis for thinking FCPX will be discontinued. Apple is actively developing it. Steve Jobs' last conversation with Randy Ubillos (inventor of Premiere and head of FCPX team) was Jobs believed in the product and wanted it updated frequently. As Jobs requested, FCPX has been updated frequently. In 2011 Apple committed to a 10-year development plan. Since then there have been 22 updates (all free), many of them major. support.apple.com/en-us/HT201237

stewpid wrote: They dropped aperture and then fcp7, both highly respected programs, without having replacements ready. Fcpx was literally years away from being ready ...

They didn't "drop" FCP 7. It allegedly still works even on Sierra. I can't provide official records for this, but I've heard they had a team working on FCP 8, which was to run in 64bit. The team was unaware of FCP X, initially developed in secrecy. It was like a competition.

You are right, FCP 10.0.1 disappointed many, myself among them. Would you like an FCP 8 now?

As far as the pro label is concerned, the world has changed. A lot. I do believe there are environments like grown "industrial pipelines" where FCP X doesn't fit all too well. But there must be a hundred thousand very small companies. In german, they are often insultingly referred to as "trunk producers". Any doubt they are the majority today?

Then there is broadcast. That's how I started long ago, as ENG freelancer for one of the biggest broadcasters in Germany. There was a slow transition from U-Matic (analog) to Digi Beta then, both processes absolutely ridiculous in comparison to cards.

If done the right way, news gathering is also ridiculously simple, straight forward and fast with FCP X, and I think AVID and others will fall behind in the medium term. They haven't seen the writing on he wall. People don't grade their features for news, they color correct, and imo the little colorboard is tremendously effective for that task.

stewpid wrote: I run a small production facility and we are currently directing and photographing a commissioned doc for a leading content provider.

Well, to each his own. It's your decision to jump ship if you're unsure about Apples future support for the pro market. I think we all want it to prosper, but in the end all we can do is hope for the best.

Axel wrote: … In german, they are often insultingly referred to as "trunk producers". …

… :lol:
yeah, 'professional' has to be complicated, a wrestle, using its own verschwurbelte lingo, blood sweat and tears! And 2mio sold seats - yeah, Apple should axe those half billion $$… just peanuts (to use another infamous German phrase).

But… folks like Brandon Li/"Hongkong Strong" ignore all that and produce, single handed wonderful movies, with even less gear to fill a trunk… maybe we should establish a new term, rucksack producers …

@Stewart
Really? I mean, really??
… the umpteenthousandth thread on this 'topic' …? <chrchrch> :pinch:

well, for whatever reason … keeping my broom in the closet…