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Banding Problem
08 Mar 2017 11:04 #86366
by mitchino
Banding Problem was created by mitchino
I'm editing some short sequences that I shot on a Sony FS5. The footage was a little grainy, so I've used Noise Ninja to improve this. There is a smooth graduated background in the shots, and when I render out a master file in ProRes HQ I'm getting banding in the graduated areas. It's not visible when playing the sequence in FCPX.
How can I get a smoother result when exporting?
How can I get a smoother result when exporting?
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08 Mar 2017 13:59 #86369
by joema
This is often seen when doing noise reduction on (typically) low-light material with a gradient subject, especially if you also do color/exposure correction. 8-bit video is really bad. If you are shooting 4k 8-bit you could try exporting at 1080p; that might help some, since uncropped 4k 8-bit is theoretically equal to 1080p 10-bit if transcoded.
Otherwise you can try adding some film grain using a tool like FilmConvert. It may seem counter-intuitive since you're trying to reduce noise. However adding grain can help avoid banding yet look more natural than the original image noise. There may be other built-in effects which would also work, but FilmConvert is all I've ever used for this case.
Replied by joema on topic Banding Problem
mitchino wrote: I'm editing some short sequences that I shot on a Sony FS5. The footage was a little grainy, so I've used Noise Ninja to improve this. There is a smooth graduated background in the shots, and when I render out a master file in ProRes HQ I'm getting banding in the graduated areas. It's not visible when playing the sequence in FCPX....
This is often seen when doing noise reduction on (typically) low-light material with a gradient subject, especially if you also do color/exposure correction. 8-bit video is really bad. If you are shooting 4k 8-bit you could try exporting at 1080p; that might help some, since uncropped 4k 8-bit is theoretically equal to 1080p 10-bit if transcoded.
Otherwise you can try adding some film grain using a tool like FilmConvert. It may seem counter-intuitive since you're trying to reduce noise. However adding grain can help avoid banding yet look more natural than the original image noise. There may be other built-in effects which would also work, but FilmConvert is all I've ever used for this case.
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08 Mar 2017 14:14 #86370
by John G
Replied by John G on topic Banding Problem
Hi
Could you post an image which shows before and after?
What format are you exporting your master file to? A fine graduation that holds up in 10-bit can often fall apart and get bandy in an 8-bit format like H.264.
One of the best ways to stop banding on fine graduations is actually to add a little bit of noise. By using Noise Ninja you may have made the graduations 'artificially' smooth, too smooth to hold together after output.
As an experiment try exporting without the noise reduction and see what you get. If the camera-noise is really bothering you you could try applying the noise reduction selectively using a mask.
John
Could you post an image which shows before and after?
What format are you exporting your master file to? A fine graduation that holds up in 10-bit can often fall apart and get bandy in an 8-bit format like H.264.
One of the best ways to stop banding on fine graduations is actually to add a little bit of noise. By using Noise Ninja you may have made the graduations 'artificially' smooth, too smooth to hold together after output.
As an experiment try exporting without the noise reduction and see what you get. If the camera-noise is really bothering you you could try applying the noise reduction selectively using a mask.
John
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