Is using "open in timeline" for a clip in the Event Browser destructive editing?

if yes;

1.What are advantages of using "open in timeline" for a clip in the Event Browser?

2.Working on the range select by using "open in timeline" for a clip in the Event Browser: does is it affect whole clip or the just select one?

3.If it does affect only select one, then is it possible to work on multi-selects on the same clip?

4.What're the best approaches to avoid pitfalls of using "open in timeline" for a clip in the Event Browser?

Although I mainly do audio work, any thoughts, any lead to many other useful scenarios or reference to working projects much appreciated...

-Soran

Open in timeline is non-destructive. It's primary uses are to adjust sync, color, sizing and such. Things you might want to alter in a clip globally before it's edited into a project.

1. Global changes to a clip before editing

2. I don't know what these means. If you open a clip, you open the whole clip, not a range, if that's what you mean.

3. No.

4. Don't ever open a clip in the timeline.

I like using open in timeline for instances of a clip I have already put in the timeline to make changes. I mainly do this for graphics, specifically layered PSD files.
For clips in the event browser, I use it to quick exports (trims and file conversions).

You don't need to open a clip in the timeline to export a segment.

You should really be able to adjust some of these settings straight in the vent browser. Say you shoot with a GoPro upside-down, currently you have to open in timeline and then rotate it 180. It would be better to just have that option in the inspector tab, but currently you can only adjust volume.

Hi Tom,

Thanks for the clarification for Q1-3.

But I'm puzzled for your recommendation on

'4. Don't ever open a clip in the timeline.'

Why? Would you kindly expand on it?

My understanding is that 'Open in timeline' is a feature that can be used in certain situation or workflow where no other way is as convenient. In my case it serves well in pre-edit audio clean-ups and the media refinements especially the clips destined to be used for multi-projects. It speeded up my workflow enormously.

Pitfalls:
it does not work with audition clips yet.
It does not work on ranges but whole clip as you say.(can be very powerful if it could)

However, it modify the event browser clip not the original media.

It seems that it works in certain situations as I can make some sense of Bill Davis's article on Creativecow :

'"Open in Timeline" isn't simply an alternate way to open timelines you've created in the Storyline index. It's essentially a separate workspace attached to the Event Browser that lets you apply changes to an EB clip and preserve them in the event browser for use in other Storylines.

Maybe think of Open in Timeline as a railroad siding rather than as a stop on the main metadata flow track?

Open in Timeline space is attached (in and out) to the EB, but it's only attached to your storylines via the EB. It's NOT directly piped into Storylines or your Project Library"

Thanks for the support,

-Soran

Question 4 was what was the best approaching to avoiding pitfalls. The short answer is don't open the clip in the timeline. There is very little that can be done there that cannot be done elsewhere, and done to ranges.

Last paragraph's a bit misleading. Whatever's in the event browser is in the library. You can open clips in the timeline from inside a project, not only from inside in the browser, and this is a separate instance of the clip and will not effect other clips or the browser clip.

Hi Jason,

Thanks for the useful input.

In your experience do get any crushes or any other peculiar behaviour in use of 'Open in timeline'?

Also you say :

'For clips in the event browser, I use it to quick exports (trims and file conversions).'

What you do with the originals? archive them or still keep them in the same library?

Much appreciated with your answers,

Thanks,
-Soran

Thanks for further clarification Tom.

I might be wrong but that the idea of a lack of pre-edit tool in FCPX, like Prelude(Adobe), led me to exploit 'Open in timeline' functionality despite its limit.
And even in its limited use I thought it is one step ahead of prelude as media management is superior within FCPX.

BTW, many editors still use Mpegstreamclip or Prelude as pre-edit tool for batch export, media refinement etc.

Here I find it very useful Larry Jordan's article as starting point:

'Open in Timeline is a hidden menu item in Final Cut Pro X that allows you to modify a clip in the Event Browser. This technique allows you to solve problems that are not easy to solve any other way.

For example, you can use Open in Timeline to:

Remove excess audio tracks from a clip
Apply an effect to a clip once, then use that clip multiple times in one or more projects
Add a title key, or sound effect, to a clip in the Event Browser.'

In this respect being aware about its limitation, I perceived 'Open in timeline' as an pre-edit tool and No more!

Well, Is it to much to expect from a tool? or Is there any better way of doing pre-edits within FCPX?

Regards,
-Soran

Aside from sync issues and multicam clips, I don't think I have ever pre-edited. You don't need to open in timeline to remove excess audio tracks. I wouldn't apply an effect or color correct without seeing it with the clips that are around it. I don't trim clips outside the application. I never do anything destructive to the original media or pre-process it. Actually I did once when I got material that was ingested in Premiere from HDV as MPEG and the hits in the recording lost sync. That was fun.

what if you had 10-12 multicam clips shot on green screen. Would it be advantageous to do the keying in "Open in Time Line" or directly in the multicam lanes?

I couldn't see any advantage in doing it using open in timeline.

This is an interesting conversation because it shows how much all our workflows and needs can be different.

A few days ago I was in Denmark talking with a number of television editors about what they would like to see improved in next FCP X updates. Although all of them had more than 12 years of experience in editing for broadcast (coming from Avid and classic FCP) and all of them are working on the same kinds of programs in the same facility, every single one of them had very different requests depending on their personal way of editing. The same goes for the "Open in Timeline" feature.

This feature can be useful as a pre-edit tool in certain circumstances, and especially with long clips that you will need to cut up: adjusting audio levels or repairing audio on interviews, fixing color balances, pre-keying, making preselects without having to create CCs, adding source tc overlays... So yes, it has its use.

Furthermore Open in Timeline is absolutely non-destructive. When you open a browser clip in its timeline and you modify the clip the modifications only affect the clip and not the original media. When you delete the modified clip from your browser and you re-import the original media the clip will be back in its original state. And if you absolutely want to avoid any pitfalls you simply duplicate the clip (CMD+D) and you open the duplicate in its timeline, you modify it and you rename it. This way you never lose the original clip in the browser.

Open in Timeline can be very simple and safe, so if it can help you I don't see why you would not use it.

- Ronny

Hi Ronny,

Thanks so much for further clarifying and throwing a light on the urgency of different needs on specific workflows.

This also show that how much versatile FCPX is and how much potential it holds in catering for different needs.

Although I was focused using only one aspect of 'Open in timeline', mainly audio, I felt a pressing need further to explore both the pitfalls and other opportunities that I am not aware of, in order to have solid workflow and most importantly I should stay doing the work within FCPX.

Of course if Apple comes up with better tool, or you pro's have a better way of dealing with certain workflows, that'll be great!

After all this all about effective media management...

Many Thanks,
-Soran

Soran wrote: Hi Jason,

Thanks for the useful input.

In your experience do get any crushes or any other peculiar behaviour in use of 'Open in timeline'?

Also you say :

'For clips in the event browser, I use it to quick exports (trims and file conversions).'

What you do with the originals? archive them or still keep them in the same library?

Much appreciated with your answers,

Thanks,
-Soran

Hey Soran,
Sorry it took me so long to get back to you, I had a long weekend and usually only check this when at work.

I have not seen any strange behaviour editing clips in their own timeline and then bringing them in to another.

I'm not sure what you mean about what to do with the originals. All editing done in Final Cut is non-destructive. The original files are still exactly the same. If I were to import the same files in a different library (or even event in the same library I think) it would not carry over any changes that were made via Open in Timeline.

I also prefer to use Open in Timeline on my multicam clips to color correct and do general sound tweaks, that way it makes working with the multicam clip easier overall.

You can duplicate an "original" in the Browser, open one in it's own timeline, tweak it, and you'll have both that and an untouched copy. Both referring back to the same, untouched physical file on the hard drive.

Everything in the Browser is a virtual container, period. Nothing is the physical file on the hard drive, everything is nondestructive.