10.08 released!!

The same as with the effects, it's when you come to animate the parameters there's very little of the animation controls that are actually there.

Something professional like this?

LumaForge Introduces 4kFLOW, an Affordable 'End-to-End' 4k Platform Based Around FCPX

"When legacy FCP was around it was accepted, there was an abundance of relevant material and interest relating to it, as there is for Premiere and Avid. I know a lot of people use Sony Vegas, but it is generally not accepted and there is comparably little around for the users."

I remember it being something of a long haul for FCP - legacy to be accepted. There was a growing community of supporters, but it wasn't "accepted" by much of the editing elites (I think I prefer that term over "pro") for quite some time. Many of the upstarts that grew the community championed it but it took until ~2005/2006 for FCP to mature to the point where it was a viable alternative in a lot of shops. That's almost 7 years!

And even then, in some camps, FCP - legacy was looked at as the tool of hacks because of some of its flaws. It wasn't an Avid. To paraphrase: It was the tool that was helping to destroy the industry by flooding it with a bunch of young hack wannabe editors that thought just because they had some software they knew how to edit. As it grew in capability, some of that was tamped down, but it still existed.

By re-designing Final Cut Pro X and offering a streamlined NLE that's simpler to use than its previous incarnation and many existing NLEs, Apple has opened itself up to the same criticism. Apple can, and probably will, increase functionality and features as FCP X matures but I think for many of the nay-sayers what FCP X is at its core is the only thing they see. They'll see it as inferior or a "toy" or a novelty system that does not, cannot and will not serve their interests.

I say so be it.

While Apple can spend a lot of its time and resources trumpeting the benefits and successes of FCP X, the thing that will get people to use it and embrace it is developing it into a great NLE. That takes time. Longer than some are willing to wait.

In the end if Apple succeeds in developing FCP X into a first rate NLE, some of the folks that ignored it or avoided it will return and become users.

And if it doesn't, then whatever Apple can say to entice people to try it out won't matter.

grailz wrote: I remember it being something of a long haul for FCP - legacy to be accepted. There was a growing community of supporters, but it wasn't "accepted" by much of the editing elites (I think I prefer that term over "pro") for quite some time.

You're correct, it faced a lot of the same criticism from people as X currently does. And as you point out, FCP "legacy" is still viewed as a "lesser" NLE by many of the Avid old guard, who still in a sense "dominate" the elite, as you call them. Oh well...

I remember it being something of a long haul for FCP - legacy to be accepted. There was a growing community of supporters, but it wasn't "accepted" by much of the editing elites (I think I prefer that term over "pro") for quite some time. Many of the upstarts that grew the community championed it but it took until ~2005/2006 for FCP to mature to the point where it was a viable alternative in a lot of shops. That's almost 7 years!

I understand that, and at the time the industry was a very different beast. The precedent has already been set for FCPX not to take the same amount of time.

I don't think championing can do any harm, I just think it would be better to have something worth championing. We started off with a foundation with potential, and we still have a foundation with potential, but I don't see the direction.

In the end if Apple succeeds in developing FCP X into a first rate NLE, some of the folks that ignored it or avoided it will return and become users.

And if it doesn't, then whatever Apple can say to entice people to try it out won't matter.

I'm with you all the way on this, I just think the way to do this is by doing what I previously stated.

I don't think telling people how great it is and that it's ready while ignoring the reality of its state is doing any good at all. Telling people how great it is in it's current state and having them look to find that to be true is all I want. I can't honestly do that, so I won't. I'll tell them of it's massive potential and of the work that needs doing rather than what I'd liked added.

NocoDave wrote:

I don't think telling people how great it is and that it's ready while ignoring the reality of its state is doing any good at all. Telling people how great it is in it's current state and having them look to find that to be true is all I want. I can't honestly do that, so I won't. I'll tell them of it's massive potential and of the work that needs doing rather than what I'd liked added.

You may have answered this previously, but what specifically do you see as the foundational problems with X currently? FWIW, I certainly don't believe it's perfect and done, just curious as to your issues...

@ Julian

In order of preference.

I think the great thing about paying for training in a class room situation is that a good trainer will pick you up where you are and tailor the course to your needs. Obviously as much as is possible under the circumstances.

The next best thing is receiving online training from people who have been grilled repeatedly by live students. This usually also costs money. Like try training a room full of die hard AVID editors who have been told by their boss that they have to learn Final Cut! Somehow experiences like this sharpen your wits and spill over into online training. The real world training experience and the what button to press experience are more than the sum of their parts.

And then there is the free, what I like to call the "Hello Internet" type. Like I might as well post a video on you tube and call it "Hello Girls"… And see how funky that gets. I am sorry but it just does not rock my boat.

At least that is the way I see it...

I remember it being something of a long haul for FCP - legacy to be accepted. There was a growing community of supporters, but it wasn't "accepted" by much of the editing elites (I think I prefer that term over "pro") for quite some time.

Could not agree more. Love the use of the word elite by the way

I understand that, and at the time the industry was a very different beast. The precedent has already been set for FCPX not to take the same amount of time.

Yeah I think we are about half way there :-o

Surely demolishing a 7 story building and starting to build new foundations from Scratch is a direction? I believe that the Apple FCP X development team is 20 people! I for one raise my half full glass to them.

what specifically do you see as the foundational problems with X currently?

I think as a foundation the event database is great, the event library I'm happy with.

The colour board I'm happy with other than that I can't rename corrections, this must be a simple fix and it would make a massive difference to working with corrections. I'd love to see a tracker in there but that's beyond the foundation and is the type of thing I'd rather they addressed the existing issues before adding.

The magnetic timeline is excellent for quickly putting together rough cuts, and other than the single frame restriction, when rolling an edit, that gets in the way at times I can work with it beyond that but would like it to be taken further as a priority. So I suppose as a foundation it's almost there, but after media management it's the workhouse of the NLE.

And the most incomplete part of the foundation is animation related. A big section of the graph editor is missing, and the keyframe interpolation doesn't work properly.

Surely demolishing a 7 story building and starting to build new foundations from Scratch is a direction? I believe that the Apple FCP X development team is 20 people! I for one raise my half full glass to them.

I think it was a direction 2 years ago, then it got scrambled and now were on the 3rd, 4th floor before the foundations were complete and the 1st floor was kind of skipped and gradually bit bit it is being returned to.

I understand just how much the development team has done, they are pressing on really fast, it's what is being given priority and what isn't that gets me down.

I have the feeling they weren't the happiest bunnies when, due to pressure, they had to move on to multi cam features and the likes.

I also think many of us should all stop pretending the current state of FCPX is rosy. I think that if the existing issues were given high priority and everything else was put on hold before taking it any further we'd be hearing all sorts of good news over a shorter space of time.

Bang on the money there mate.

Just got a call from one of the bigger post houses asking If I can do some onlining and grading for them. On guess what.....? PREMIERE!

At first I was shocked but they explained it was really because of the way it integrates so well with After Effects.

This is another problem with FCP X. Report card reads: "Doesn't play well with others."

I'm hearing that it seems Apple's NAB press briefing was a big zero.
Just a recap of things the press already knows.
Nothing about future roadmap.
I heard the mentioned that FCPX has outsold FCP7 (not all of legacy). Given the number of seats that people didn't move from 6 to 7 (Studio 2 to Studio 3) I'm not even sure that's that big.

So Apple's "big marketing push" has been an update to their "In Action" page. Sheesh!

That would make me very sad. They would have been better NOT to have announced a PR push at. As it is, they're throwing a spotlight on themselves when EVEREONE is announcing new products- and Apple has nothing to say.

I give the dev team every credit, but whoever is handling PR is NOT helping.

Exactly what NAB press briefing are you talking about?

I give the dev team every credit, but whoever is handling PR is NOT helping

Agree 100% Credit where credit is due.

Go, go, go dev team.

And yes if this is true about Apple none announcement, talk about crappy timing.

Elephants on the run in a China Shop! Duck every one. And that is not Peking Duck…

I remember similar sentiments at the IBC 2 years ago.

The Apple dealers traveled all the way to Amsterdam to be told nothing...

BenB wrote: Exactly what NAB press briefing are you talking about?

The same press briefings they held last year where they pre-announced the 10.0.6 features.

Imagine the harried reporter having to cover a zillion things going to a briefing like this and waling with, "why did you just waste my time talking about what I can see on your site, the "In Action" page and a Google search.

Personally I see this as hurting them. Their marketing of FCPX is bordering on self destructive if this is the case. There's no blog post from the "usual suspects" which may be telling.

Are the Apple Marketeers Masochistic? :sick:

The Adobe marketing team are pulling at the leash hoping to cut Apples throat!

tv.adobe.com/embed/1199/17413

It's a big bummer. Adobe making a splash. AVID just announced a Media Composer upgrade www.avid.com/US/press-room/Avid-Media-Co...roduction-Everywhere

And a new version of Pro Tools.

Meanwhile, those of us who have hitched our wagon to FCPX are all dressed up with no where to go to NAB Prom.

I mean, couldn't they have released 10.0.8 at NAB and made that the PR move? It's like they go out of their way to avoid any semblance of caring about pro editors. Makes no sense. But it is how Apple has done it for the past half-dozen years. It is infuriating, though.

I think the answer is simple. FCPX still has the potential it always has had. Apple need to give the development team way more resources to let the product speak for itself.

I had quite a bit of expectation too. This is quite disappointing. I really am wondering what is going on with the Apple PR these days.