"Move To Trash" now flat out "Deletes"

I just discovered two things about 10.0.5 that are disturbing.

When I take a clip in an Event, and do a "Move To Trash" function, it does not move it to the trash at all, but flat out DELETES THE FILE immediately! I've done this with several types of clips, too. I know this isn't correct as I've demo'ed this in several FCPX classes, showing students the clips were still sitting in the trash. But now they don't even make it to the trash, they simply get flat out deleted.

I put a test file in my Trash. The launched FCPX 10.0.5 and did a "Move To Trash" with a clip. When I look back in the Trash, my test file is there still, but there's now no trace of that FCPX filed on my system anywhere.

I've also found that doing a "copy" of an audio clip recorded inside of FCPX from one Event to another only creates a symbolic link file in the second Event. So you don't have two copies, just one. If you move the fist copy to the trash, the second copy is useless.

So why do audio recordings in FCPX copy differently from other media?
And why does "Move To Trash" suddenly do a flat out "Delete"?

not sure "why" the things you describe are the way they are
maybe a bug?

thankfully though, one of the things that bothered me about FCPX - making huge copies of every piece of media you import, even if you tell it not to - is actually the saving grace in this situation

your original files are never deleted or damaged

I noticed this prior to 10.0.5

What I have found is if the file is imported into the event and I delete it I get a message that says "Cannot be undone. This operation is not undoable because trash isn't supported. Continue anyway?" If you say "OK" it is gone. I imagine this has something to do with the database nature of FCP X.

What I do is import camera footage into my events but keep other files (music, voiceovers, graphics) in a client folder on the same RAID and just link to them (I.e.: don't import into events folder). My thinking is that if I want to delete footage I want it off the RAID anyway. If I just don't want to see it in the event I can reject it. If I delete my non-camera footage from the event it still lives in its own folder on the RAID and is still accessible.

This isn't ideal, I'll agree although I have adjusted to it. It would be easy to delete a piece of footage in the heat of battle so all the more reason to retain a backup.

TrixTrax9000 wrote:
your original files are never deleted or damaged

Not sure this is ALWAYS true. If you are copying events into FCP folders then you are editing from those copies. If you are referencing events instead, and have no optimized counterparts, then I believe this is NOT non-destructible. In other words, if you delete the referenced clip in your browser, you are actually deleting the original referenced clip.

I could be wrong about this, but hopefully someone can confirm as I seem to recall FCPX tells you when that media is going to be gone for good.

I was importing these, and NOT dropping them into any Timelines. It more often than not, testing again, tells me other assets that access that clip's resources may not be useable if that clip is Moved To The Trash, and that the operation is undoable. But I don't see the warnings saying the clip will be deleted ASAP and not simply moved to the trash. Why would some clips not be able to simply go to the trash, as the command clearly states?

Wow, if those two are true, those are pretty bad bugs.

Also, the media management isn't always very clear. You have this great potential of the Events and Projects, but like TrixTrax said, sometimes you just want to copy a project somewhere, and even though you think it would only copy the project itself, it goes ahead and begins copying media.

I do think that (again, I haven't tested the bugs, but I'll take your word for it) with bugs like that, Apple needs to get their stuff in order.
FCP X has a very bad reputation, and the updates have helped a lot. Still having bugs like that after a year, which is the phase in which sceptic people were believing FCP X would finally be able to be taken serious in the NLE world, having new bugs like that is a killer.

BTW: not saying FCP X is professional or not, but talking about the perception people have of it. Apple did some things wrong with the launch, that they should put their best programmers on it and put some serious work on this app if they want to grab more market share.

If you right-click an Project in the Project Library, you have a choice to copy media or not, actually. So you can chose what it does. I'm not aware of any bugs in this process, but would like to hear from anyone who has found them.

Is this a FCPX or Lion thing? On one of my Lion updates I had the same thing start happening with deleting files from external drives. It always used to send to trash, but now it just deletes it there (no trash). I have the same problem with some external drives when using Lightroom.

I've been using Lion since it was first released and never saw this happen anywhere but FCP X.

That's interesting. I'm going to keep a closer eye on this and see if I can pinpoint when it happens. I've just kind of gotten used to it.

Check your Finder preferences, also.

I did a test and I don't have this problem, it move the file to the trash.

FCP X 10.0.5
Mac OS X 10.6.8

I think it's a Lion vs Snow Leopard thing. Lion saves differently than previous OS's

Well have tried serval things. Imported from different drives, including my system drive. Imported different media types. Every time I hit Command Delete I get the warning dialogue.
If I proceed the file always ends up in the trash. Doesn't matter if I copied the footage to the Event or not.

So I suspect Ben has found some kind of weird inconsistent bug.

Seanus - what OS are you on? Is it Snow Leopard?

I think I figured this "behavior" out. Think of hitting the 'delete' key (which rejects the clip but retains it in the event) as putting something "in the trash". You can hide rejected clips in the event library but still have access to them (as if they were in the trash). You can "un-rate" them if you need them back in the event. They are still accessible.

Think of 'option delete' (which permanently deletes the clip in the event) as "emptying the trash".

This actually makes sense in the context of keeping the management of media within FCP X.

OK, I wasn't using Opt-Delete, I was using the menu, which is labeled "Move To Trash". So anything that gets deleted automatically shouldn't. and it's Command Delete for Move To Trash, Option-Delete resets the current color board. According to the user manual, the Trash should never be emptied by FCPX, nor should any clip ever be flat out "delted" by FCPX.

And why is there no "Remove From Event" option, for when I want to remove a clip from an Event, but leave it on my hard drive?

I re-tested this morning and am finding the behavior is back to normal, not emptying the trash. It flat out deleted files for a few days, now it doesn't. Curious.

Sorry - that should be "command delete" and not "option delete"

FWIW I'm on Lion. Man how can you be "bleeding edge" with FCP X and still be on Snow Leopard? :woohoo:

There are users still on SL?

LOL!

I don't have anything go to trash if I hit "command delete" and accept the dialogue boxes that follow. Those files just go away forever. I have reported this to Apple.